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Copying and moving files

[quote="jon"]Sorry but this whole concept just seems silly to me.

Opus is designed to do what you tell it. If you tell it to copy some files, it will copy them. Copying files isn't a destructive action - if you copy the wrong files to the wrong place, just delete them afterwards.

We have confirmation for any destructive actions (delete, replace, etc). Anything that can't potentially destroy data doesn't need confirmation.

Opus is a power tool and we expect that the people who are using it will, to some extent at least, know what they are doing. If you don't want to copy some files, don't copy them![/quote]

If that is the opinion of the Dopus team the I have a simple answer - I won't use Dopus. There are plenty of other file managers available just as powerful.

I've been in computing for some 40+ years and written a fair amount of Control System software, I DO know what I am doing but, like everybody else, occasionally make mistakes. A "Do you want to do this..." prompt requires one keystroke to answer. The UNDO feature is not a solution - in fact it is an admission that users (or Dopus) can make mistakes and nullifies your argument "that the people who are using it will ... know what they are doing".

I was going to post some further questions / suggestions in the forum, but I think that will be rather pointless.

[quote="Nodrog"]
If that is the opinion of the Dopus team the I have a simple answer - I won't use Dopus. There are plenty of other file managers available just as powerful.[/quote]

Actually there aren't. There are plenty of other file managers but in terms of feature set none really compare - mainly due to the configurability which has no peer.

[quote="Nodrog"]
I was going to post some further questions / suggestions in the forum, but I think that will be rather pointless.[/quote]

Not at all. As Jon said, he sees no benefit in a confirmation dialog for what is a harmless action - he said nothing about the idea of a more general warning dialog which can be added to any button. What's wrong with using undo or delete if you do copy files erroneously on the odd occasion. Even a move can be easily undone or moved back - hardly destructive. It seems a little bit petulant to abandon further Opus exploration simply because you don't like an answer from a developer on one tiny feature.

When those other file managers have all of this covered I'll be happy to consider it.

LOL:

just playin

Just what are you implying, mr. steje???

:slight_smile:

What I actually meant to say was that I tend to agree with Jon's general attitude about this one... though maybe for different reasons. I think Tanis' idea about a generic user command that could be used in any button to provide a sort of safety net is totally legit for those who would find it helpful. But personally, I've always found with the various applications I use that employ similar 'are you sure' prompts that my click-happy fingers tend to just march right on through :slight_smile:. They don't actually make me stop and say 'ok self... do you really want to do this'. Instead I've trained myself to basically ignore them, and then I HATE them because I DO make blunders. And after making one, want to beat myself repeatedly with my keyboard for not only making it, but not stopping myself when offered the chance. Arghhh... so all this means is that I would not choose to use the feature Tanis proposes... so as to avoid yet further self-inflcited and well-deserved head trauma :slight_smile:.

One thought about a generic type of continue/abort dialog... would it really be 'that' helpful if it were so generic that the dialog itself didn't offer some meaningful evaluation and info about the operation about to be performed? Just a bit of 'devils advocate' thought...

Nah... nothing. Just felt frisky is all :slight_smile:.

I always saw it taking some arguments which define the title and message body. Pretty simple but would do the job nicely.

[quote="Nodrog"]If that is the opinion of the Dopus team the I have a simple answer - I won't use Dopus. There are plenty of other file managers available just as powerful.

I've been in computing for some 40+ years and written a fair amount of Control System software, I DO know what I am doing but, like everybody else, occasionally make mistakes. A "Do you want to do this..." prompt requires one keystroke to answer. The UNDO feature is not a solution - in fact it is an admission that users (or Dopus) can make mistakes and nullifies your argument "that the people who are using it will ... know what they are doing".[/quote]

Hi Nodrog,

With all respect, and I've been using computers since 1969, this thread and concept is just silly.

If you want to copy files then you select the files you want to copy - otherwise don't select them. Yes, and on occasions you may make an error, just like typing on a keyboard when you hit 's' insteead of 'a'. Not only is it totally unproductive to ask for confirmation on every action, it's just plain silly.

It is just a nonsense to suggest that non-destructive actions should have a conformation dialog every time. In fact this breaks just about all the user guidelines for program design. The basic tenant of good interface design demands that a confirmation dialog be meaningful, otherwise it is not only useless but dangerous, potentially leading to more errors because the user will automatically disregard and devalue the action and always accept it. Conformation should only appear when an action is potentially destructive or abnormal, so alerting the user to something unusual.

What you are asking for is the equivalent of a confirmation dialog for every key typed on the keyboard. "Do you really mean to hit the 'S' key or did you mean to use 'A'? Just nonsense.

You may find other programs which give you such nonsense but it is completely against modern interface design guidelines.

__
Regards, Dr Greg Perry, GPSoftware

[quote="Nodrog"][quote="jon"]Sorry but this whole concept just seems silly to me.

Opus is designed to do what you tell it. If you tell it to copy some files, it will copy them. Copying files isn't a destructive action - if you copy the wrong files to the wrong place, just delete them afterwards.

We have confirmation for any destructive actions (delete, replace, etc). Anything that can't potentially destroy data doesn't need confirmation.

Opus is a power tool and we expect that the people who are using it will, to some extent at least, know what they are doing. If you don't want to copy some files, don't copy them![/quote]

If that is the opinion of the Dopus team the I have a simple answer - I won't use Dopus. There are plenty of other file managers available just as powerful.

[/quote]

Actually, while there are plenty of other file managers available, I've yet to find ANY as powerful.

And for me, jon's and greg's responses are reasons for me to purchase Dopus. Seems they just might be against unnecessary feature "bloat" :smiley:

cheers

I tend to think this thread has become a little off subject.
All that was asked for was a confirmation dialog for copying files.

Perhaps a bit of respect for our elders could help here.
My HP 48 calculator always asks for confirmation when I copy files using its' default file manager.
I replaced it long ago with the French PCT library. PCT does not ask for confirmation.
The process is still tedious at best !
But the calculator is extremely powerful and flexible with its' RPL programming language.
I have the utmost respect for Dr. Wickes and Reverse Polish Lisp.

Enough said.
Merry Christmas !
:opussanta: porcupine

Actually, before using DOpus, I used Total Commander a lot. I really like the confirmation before moving/copying. I understand that it might be a somewhat useless feature, but I like the "rhythm" that it provides when I move and copy a lot of files around. I actually requested this feature a couple of times but the Dopus programmers feel that it's not really a useful feature, which is understandable, and I respect that.

One way I have gotten to work around it is to save a layout that I call "TC-imitation" to imitate as closely as possible Total Commander. I made a couple of custom extra buttons called "Move Deluxe" and "Copy Deluxe", which allow me to copy/move with a dialog confirmation. I got the code for the buttons from this forum somewhere. Here it is for the Copy command:

dopusrt /cmd Copy TO HERE CREATEFOLDER "{dlgstring|Specify folder-name to COPY items to...|{d}}"

I'll also attach a screenshot of what it does. Basically, the button will just copy the selected files from the active pane to the destination pane with a confirmation dialog which will automatically show the path to the destination directory, but since it is paused, you can type in another directory if you wish. But I never do, I just like seeing the dialog there. Here it is:

Hope it helps. Thanks to steje for his help, as usual.


Aha... and the nice thing about using this method is that it shows you the path in the dialog. Soooo, if the blunder that you would otherwise make is that you've dragged over to an undesired destination folder, you can catch that in the dialog.

Woohooo! Nice contribution superboy - a voice of reason! Hey Nodrog - hows that work?

Unfortunately, steje, I think Nodrog meant it when he "threatened" not to use DOpus anymore. Oh well. I can only wish him luck in finding a more powerful file manager, I actually think it is impossible because it doesn't exist. If it did, I would have bought one by now!

a cosmetic (!) query for superboy, or anyone else who knows re his screen shot above :arrow_right:

how do you get the selected folder tab to show in a different colour?

how to get different colours in the status bar?

how do you get "seperators" on a tool bar e.g. on the drivebar between C: & other drives? :question:

Go to Preferences / Display / Colors & Fonts and select Folder Tabs from the drop-down list of items.

Status bar colours are set using hex RGB codes:

<#ff0000>{sd}/{td} folders</#>

That would show the folder count in red.

This is in the PDF manual under Preferences / Display / Status Bar but unfortunately is not mentioned under the Status Bar Control Sequences section at the end so you could be forgiven for missing it. :slight_smile:

You haven't watched my Toolbar Editing Video Tutorial? :cry:

When in Customize mode you simply drag a button slightly away from the one next to it to create a separator. You can also right-click it and select Begin a Group if you prefer.

hi Leo

i HAVE read your tutorial but NO, havent looked at the video, embarrassed to say the speakers dont work on my computer. (embarrassed cause its been that way a very long time...)

I'll download it and have a look ~ should still be able to figure out stuff...

I did check out statusbar codes as you thought,
& re the tabs, sometimes its so easy to miss the obvious, innit?

actually just tried to download video from the tutorial page link:
resource.dopus.com/Files/videos/Toolbar1.html
but I got:

Not Found
The requested URL /Files/videos/Toolbar1.html was not found on this server.

Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.

will try again another day,
thanks for your help & patience!
tom

Just after I posted I noticed my tutorial page still had a few broken links as a result of the Resource Centre move but I think I've fixed them all now. If you notice any others let me know!

They're also linked here in the Tutorials forum along with a bunch of others. All worth checking out!

Don't worry, there's no sound in any of my video tutorials (yet :slight_smile:).

Thank you superboy, that unveils a lot of new possibilities for me.

What I want to do is to replace Windows Recycle Bin and use a normal folder for storing files that I will eventually delete. I think using a normal folder is more usable and faster.

I've created a folder c:\MyTrash and defined a user command this way:

dopusrt /cmd Copy MOVE TO "{dlgstring|Move to MyTrash...|C:\MyTrash}"

That is similar to your confirmation dialog and it works for me, but I'd prefer to show only a confirmation dialog (with yes/no buttons), not a string dialog where I can change the destination folder.

Do you know whether it is possible? I've read the manual and I haven't found a confirmation dialog.

By the way, my opinion about the dialog-discussion is that dialogs can be very useful so I think DOpus should add them. It doesn't matter if we are computer experts that never make a mistake (which is not true, at least for me); dialogs are still* a very powerful feature.

  • (should i have used "yet" there? My english is not very good...)

I think it would be better to have dialog commands (more or less) like these examples:

DIALOG "Enter destination folder" STORE IN {destfolder}
COPY TO {destfolder}

COPY TO {DIALOG "Enter destination folder"}

DIALOG CONFIRMATION "Really move to Trash?" COPY MOVE TO "C:\MyTrash"

Regards

I have a question to add to this old thread. In the screenshot above, you can see how my copy/move button brings up the dialog for confirmation. Is there a way to list the files that are selected for the move/copy in that dialog? How would I add this to the script?